Alexander Kalyagin interview. Anniversary conversation

On the evening of Wednesday, November 8, a meeting ended at the STD, at which Alexander Kalyagin, artistic directors and directors of the capital’s theaters (including Alexey Borodin, Oleg Tabakov, Mark Zakharov, Kama Ginkas, Maria Revyakina, Evgeny Pisarev) called for a review of the laws governing creative processes. In the near future, a working group will be created at the STD, and the results of its work will be presented at the next meeting of the Council under the President of the Russian Federation for Culture and Art.

The reason for such serious actions was, according to Kalyagin, “a campaign to discredit the cultural sphere, carefully thought out, and which is being carried out in several directions.” He outlined his position in detail in a separate speech. "Theater" quotes this speech in full:

– I think there is no need to explain why there was a need to gather today and hold an emergency extended meeting of the STD Secretariat.

We truly find ourselves in an emergency situation, which is alarming to all of us, but, nevertheless, I want to urge everyone not to turn our meeting into a political rally.

Quite a lot of loud statements have already been made in the press, and we need to try to avoid hysterical attacks, we will not be like some media.

Less emotion, let's focus on constructive and serious conversation.

On the other hand, we need to find the most accurate and balanced ways to express our position to society.

Which, in my opinion, is obvious. A carefully thought-out campaign has been launched to discredit the cultural sphere, and is being conducted in several directions. And this is not only the “Serebrennikov Case”, which we have all been following for several months. You know all the twists and turns of this case and all the defendants - we tried to speak out in defense of each of them, made personal guarantees, but to no avail. Now charges have been brought against the former head of the Department for Support of Arts and Folk Art, Sofya Apfelbaum. And this arrest qualitatively changed the situation. Why? I think that when the legality of the actions of an official acting on behalf and on behalf of the Government is called into question, then private history takes on other dimensions and requires systemic and political generalizations. And our task is to conduct a serious analysis of the legislation regulating the support of art and the control supervision of this very support. Where are the contradictions? Where does the inconsistency occur? Why is there always a risk of going beyond the law?

But I repeat, the “Seventh Studio” case is only one part of the denunciation campaign of theater workers. In parallel with loud reports and the courtroom, many articles with screaming headlines, a Transparency International study on conflicts of interest in theaters appears in the information field. And again, theater managers are presented as swindlers who sign their own fees and who are ready to grab themselves a “fattier piece” by any means. And before that, the incomes of the heads of Moscow theaters were cunningly, with caustic comments, analyzed in order to demonstrate how well theater workers live, unlike everyone else. Who is this campaign for? For the people? For political elites? And why now, on the eve of elections in the country? Do they want to throw us to the margins of the country’s public life? Someone is diligently trying to isolate cultural figures and deprive the President of their support. It is also known that the “Platform Case” was thrown into the public space and is unfolding immediately before the elections, although it began back in 2015. Naturally, the current situation cannot but cause concern for the STD.

And the second thing that scares me personally is no less. This is a frank, public demonstration of disrespect for an individual, a demonstration of strength, and a derogatory attitude towards a person. Not to the criminal! Sofya Apfelbaum is not yet a criminal, her guilt has not been proven, and a young woman with children is sitting in a cage. It is impossible to look at this. She did not commit a terrible crime, did not kill anyone, and it has not even been proven that there were financial irregularities in her activities. Her reputation has been damaged, and her reputation and her life have been dealt such a blow from which it will be difficult to recover. Who will be responsible for this?

I'm not even talking about the fact that the opinions of famous cultural figures and their guarantees are simply not heard; I have the feeling that they were thrown into the trash like unnecessary papers. But if these authorities and their guarantees are so insignificant, then how can these same people act effectively and be perceived by citizens as trustees of the President?

We understand that the current legislative norms are of little use for regulating creative processes, and we need to come up with a proposal to the President to revise the layered regulatory mechanisms, as well as with a proposal to begin preparing a new law “On Culture” and involving representatives of the theater community in its preparation.

My proposal is to create a special working group of the STD or an expert-analytical Center of the STD, which would deal with all these issues, and at the next meeting of the Council under the President of the Russian Federation for Culture and Art this proposal should be made.

Evgenia Glushenko and Alexander Kalyagin are two stars of Russian theater and cinema. At the time they met, each of them could not even imagine that they would become husband and wife. And, most importantly, they will be able to save their family for many years. They do not allow strangers into their lives, do not comment on emerging scandals and refuse to talk about their relationships in front of cameras. But they have been together for almost 40 years, which in itself is proof: family is the most important thing in their lives.

First meetings

They met in 1977, on the set of “An Unfinished Piece for Mechanical Piano.” In the drama by Nikita Mikhalkov, Kalyagin played Mikhail Vasilyevich Platonov, Evgeniy - Sashenka Platonova, his wife. Their performance was so authentic and piercing that the audience immediately decided that there was an affair between Kalyagin and Glushenko. Such a young actress cannot play such feelings, you can only experience them. Although in fact they were really in love at that time. Evgenia into another man, Alexander into another woman.

By the time they met, Alexander Kalyagin had already experienced a personal tragedy; his first wife, Tatyana Korunova, had died. He was left alone with his five-year-old daughter Ksenia in his arms. He never complained about difficulties, but did everything to ensure that his Ksanyulka did not need anything. He categorically did not tolerate and does not tolerate pity addressed to him, he simply worked, not allowing himself to relax.

At the time of approval for the role, Evgenia Glushenko had already served at the Maly Theater for three years after graduating from the Shchepkinsky School. The young, very bright and at the same time very strong actress could not go unnoticed. Alexander Kalyagin appeared in her life only a year after the end of filming.

When love comes

Colleagues of Alexander Kalyagin recall: many women tried to win the heart of an enviable bachelor. One could form a real queue of them. True, young Evgenia had no idea about anything and did not try to charm the famous actor. He appeared on his own.

Alexander Kalyagin, even during filming, saw a holy girl in Evgenia Glushenko. He considered himself a real eagle: he was a celebrity, handsome, a favorite of spectators and women. According to the actor, he was incredibly lucky; meeting Evgenia became his lucky ticket.

On their first date they went to the theater. In general, it would be a stretch to call it a date. They sat in the auditorium, watching their colleagues on stage with interest, and then discussed their own and others’ roles. Communication was easy, but more reminiscent of communication between two colleagues. The rapprochement proceeded slowly, but mutual interest had already outgrown the professional boundaries.

Alexander Kalyagin and Evgenia Glushenko were already confident in their feelings, but Evgenia had one more, most important test to pass. Alexander Kalyagin long ago promised himself that he would marry for the second time only to the woman whom his daughter Ksenia would accept.

The girl herself approached her father’s chosen one with the words: “Aunt Zhenya, move in with dad and me!” And in 1978, Alexander Kalyagin and Evgenia Glushenko became husband and wife.

The secret behind seven locks

Evgenia Konstantinovna at the age of 26 became the second mother for Ksenia. According to colleagues, the actress always treated the girl as her own daughter. And two years after the marriage, the couple had a son, Denis.

Her parents helped the actress a lot with her child. When she went on tour, her son stayed with his grandparents. At one time, Evgenia’s parents made her decision to become an actress. So, after many years, Evgenia will react favorably to the choice of professions for her adult children.

Ksenia became a programmer, lives in America, and in 2001 her son Matvey was born. Denis became a journalist. The daughter and son, just like the parents, carefully protect the family life of their parents from prying eyes. They never give interviews and avoid talking about the personal lives of Alexander Alexandrovich and Evgenia Konstantinovna.

Kalyagin and Glushenko believe that the family is an area that should be closed from viewers and journalists.

No matter how difficult it is

The spouses did not comment on the emerging rumors and scandals surrounding the name of Alexander Kalyagin. At that time he was already running his own theater “Et Cetera”. Kalyagin’s novels with young actresses and even his alleged harassment began to be actively discussed in the yellow press.

Unceremonious journalists simply besieged the actress, calling her at any time. She made the only correct decision in that situation: Evgenia Glushenko simply ignored all the dirty insinuations. After all, not a single rumor has ever been proven. And despite the yellow articles, Kalyagin and Glushenko still remain husband and wife. And they still don’t let anyone into their lives.

In 2018, the married couple will celebrate the 40th anniversary of their married life. And is it possible to live in marriage for so many years without mutual love?

Evgenia Glushenko was remembered by viewers for her role as Vera in the film

About four years ago, one event happened - generally insignificant, but, it seems to me, quite funny. Alexander Alexander Kalyagin, who was then touring in Israel, came to Ben Gurion Airport to meet someone. Coming to his senses at the last minute, he rushed around the waiting room in search of a flower stall. It was then that a tall young man with glasses approached him. And he not only approached, but also inquired: “Alexander Alexandrovich, are there any problems?” “Oh,” Kalyagin was delighted, “do you speak Russian? Help me, please, find the flowers.” We bought flowers, talked a little about the topic: “from you to us” - and went our separate ways.

I suppose we’ll come back to the end of this story, but for now I’ve been sitting in the hotel lobby for forty minutes, waiting to meet Kalyagin. Crazy, of course, although he warned that he might be late... Finally he appears and apologizes; invites me to go up to the room, manages to give an autograph to some couple in the elevator. We go out onto a spacious balcony overlooking the sea, the weather is wonderful; on the table there are fruits, juice... The water for coffee has boiled and life already seems almost wonderful...

- Alexander Alexandrovich...

I heard you don't accept middle names.

- Sasha, the other day the benefit performance of Zinovy ​​Efimovich Gerdt was shown again on television - the very last one. In his speech, Zhvanetsky noted: “You can’t say about an actor: “how smart!” - until you write to him. Your comments.

I love Misha Zhvanetsky very much, but he was probably just unlucky with the actors... He expressed his own opinion, this is his point of view - why should I comment... However, my acting, directing and teaching experience gives me the right to say that that an actor - due to the very specifics of our profession - should least of all fall into philosophical reasoning. By God, we shouldn't theorize. It is very desirable for us to pass cinema, theater, literature, life phenomena through another channel - the emotional one. It is clear that the actor is not a theorist, but a practitioner, so he must go on stage and emotionally convey to the viewer everything that was written by the playwright and staged by the director. In order to play Hamlet (I deliberately take the top), it is not at all necessary to think deeply about the meaning of existence. It’s enough to feel like a Danish prince at least once - and play it... Misha Zhvanetsky, of course, is a witty and intelligent person, but an actor is something else. Although, what’s more, I myself don’t think our brother is too smart.

- Well, we started with an angry rebuke to Zhvanetsky - and in the end we agreed with him.

It turns out like this... You see, how good it is that he uttered this phrase precisely at Gerdt’s anniversary, thereby emphasizing that Zinovy ​​Efimovich is a great exception to the rule.

Best of the day

- Is a smart actor an exception after all?

In this case we are not talking about a simple exception, but about a great one. As for smart actors... I don’t want to say that our brother is completely stupid, God forbid! Naturally, in our profession, as in any other, there are people with both narrow and broad horizons. But in general, by the way, it is a deep misconception to believe that an actor must be smart.

- What should it be like?

Wise. Just like a woman: it probably won’t hurt her to be smart, but it’s not at all necessary. In the story “The Seven Wives of Raoul Bluebeard” Anton Pavlovich Chekhov gave a whole classification of women, including writing about smart women, from whose tongue “spiritualism”, “positivism”, “materialism” just poured out... No, a woman should not be smart, but wise.

- What, in your opinion, is wisdom?

In gaining experience. When I meet such a woman, I am completely delighted. And, honestly, I don’t care how many books she’s read - why should a woman be assessed on some artificial scale? And - not only the woman. It doesn’t matter how many books Einstein read, the main thing is that he was wise. So, I think an actor should not be smart, but wise, and this is not the same thing at all. Zinovy ​​Efimovich was just wise.

- And yet, I don’t quite understand...

- “Come on, Stirlitz, you understand everything!..” You’re interviewing a lot of people, some of whom I can’t hold a candle to. You constantly see us opposite you and you probably know: smart is not smart; wise - not wise... This is immediately clear - from what he talks about, how he puts letters and phrases together... In general, I have a big request to you: improve me in this conversation, okay? I love it when they make me better, more beautiful, smarter. And don't smile - I'm serious...

- Oh, Sasha, you’re being disingenuous: you don’t really need to be “improved.” Unlike many others... If you're already talking about this, I'll confess a secret: I recently talked with one well-known lady...

And “made” her smarter? That's right: why admit to the reader that your interlocutor does not shine with wisdom?..

- Well, it’s clear: you insist that the interviewer should embellish the interlocutors.

In any case, the interlocutors. You see what the matter is... My mother, Yulia Mironovna Zaideman, gave birth to me late, at forty years old: before me there was a child who died... I was raised mainly by women: my mother, my aunts... And through all my life life has passed with unshakable confidence: any woman next to me is wiser than me, smarter, more tactful, more intelligent.

- Speak well!

I really feel like we men are missing a lot. Sometimes you talk to a woman - and suddenly you clearly understand that you are the same goat as the previous one: the same questions, the same cliches, the same cliches... I feel so ashamed, I swear to you!..

- Are you ashamed of men?

For myself: dear mother, am I really the same? I don’t know the previous one, but I’m definitely a goat, because I repeated myself, became a “stamper”.

- Isn’t it possible to come up with something more original?

So the fact of the matter is that it doesn’t work out... After all, most questions presuppose certain answers in advance - you know that better than me. And it's all cream. As in “cappuccino”: to get to the coffee, you need to eat this damn cream, which won’t go down your throat. Coffee, in fact, is nothing at all; but give us, the actors, the cream: we love to think thoughtfully about various topics... Be lenient: among us there are happy ones, but, basically, artists are unhappy creatures. Very complex, deprived in many ways: they didn’t play something, they didn’t love someone...

-Have you by any chance dreamed of a lawyer's career?

I’m not defending anyone, I just urge you to take into account some objective and subjective circumstances - then you won’t judge our cliches so harshly in interviews. In the end, journalists also spoil us with a variety of questions very rarely.

- Say better: “never.”

No, there are interesting questions, but you don’t always “taxi”; sometimes you can’t answer the simplest one properly... For various reasons. Does a person have the right to feel bad, to finally get sick?

- Can an actor afford such luxury?

That's the trouble, it can't, but it happens to everyone... Not only during interviews, but also on stage. Or - with a woman: everything seems to be going as it should, but you are not witty, not easy with her, preoccupied with something, in a word - out of shape... Therefore, I ask: improve me. But whatever you want. You are not Karaulov...

- What about Karaulov? In my opinion, he is a strong professional. I heard that getting into his program is considered very prestigious.

Maybe it counts, but I'm not going. I openly say: “Andrey, I’m afraid of you.” He called, persuaded; He promised to discuss the topic in advance, even show the recording before the broadcast, but I don’t believe him. No, of course, Karaulov is a professional. He perfectly knows how to “turn on” his interlocutor with his creepy, difficult questions. But this is not for me: “Listen, everyone says that you are shit: even your own mother. How do you feel about this?” A man sits in front of a camera - and he feels like this... Well, this is not a new thing: there are such “shock” interviewers everywhere - but I like others.

- It turns out interesting: everyone knows that Karaulov is “dangerous”, but they are trying to get into the program - even, if you believe the rumors, they pay money, and a lot of it...

I don't know about money. Why do they go?.. Sometimes because they need to. Believe me, when our theater was getting on its feet, I went to any interviews: I needed advertising. Not Kalyagin the actor, whom millions know, but Kalyagin the artistic director of the theater... True, I didn’t go to Karaulov even at that time. Of course, there are people who like this “fried”, some probably like to answer provocative questions. And I admit quite sincerely: I’m afraid. Not because I’m trying to hide anything, although each of us has some intimate things that we can admit only to ourselves. And even then - not always: sometimes you need to have special courage for this... No, perhaps, I’m not afraid to open up to Karaulov, but I just don’t like his style - that’s all...

- What do you have to be afraid of? Somehow I don’t remember any unsuccessful Kalyagin roles.

To be honest, it happened. I don’t want to list them now, but - alas... It’s not that they’re complete failures, but when they show them on TV, I twitch every time: I clearly see that I played “on a good standard.” Happens.

- Especially, probably, when acting fades into the background for you?

A strange thing is happening to me now: on the one hand, I am happy, but on the other, I always feel the weight of the burden that I have shouldered.

- Of course, what a position: Chairman of the Union of Theater Workers of Russia. What is the point, by the way?

Let me explain in a nutshell. Back in Tsarist Russia, there was a “Theatrical Society for Assistance to Actors” - the emperor himself took it under his wing. Under Soviet rule there were many creative unions, but the only one that has managed not to fall apart is ours. Unfortunately, today's times are not the easiest to survive. All our real estate, financial power, is glitter and poverty. My main task is to maintain shine and overcome poverty.

- What about creativity?

Then, then... First we need to achieve “the little things”: to make sure that we, theater workers, begin to live at least a little better.

-Have you turned into an administrator?

Don't exaggerate: of course, I'm not going to relearn. As you yourself understand, at fifty-four it’s stupid to start seriously getting involved in all these clearing-leasing-dealers... No, I’ll never become an administrator again, that’s for sure.

- How can we achieve “life becomes better”?

To do this, first of all you need to recruit a decent team. You know what the Americans say: “The best boss is the one they work for, not the one who works himself.” But I am, after all, an actor; Right now, by the way, I’m rehearsing the role of Shakespeare in Bernard Shaw’s play.

- And you also lead a theater group.

Moscow State Theater "Et cetera". We are very happy: we finally got our own building. On Novy Arbat, opposite the House of Books, in the very center of Moscow - fantastic, it doesn’t happen.

- And how did you do it?

Probably, my last letter - a real cry of despair - forced Luzhkov to do this. The theater has a permanent troupe of fifteen people; We will engage in enterprise: invite interesting actors to play roles.

-Are you satisfied?

Let's put it this way: I want to work, passion is alive. I am a graduate of the Shchukin school, but I have worked all my life at the Art Theater, which I consider my family. Maybe I wouldn’t have left there until now, but a difficult thing happened. I probably made a mistake when I took part in the Moscow Art Theater section, I was one of those who signed letters... It is known that my teacher Oleg Nikolaevich Efremov has a special magnetism: he convinced us. Oleg Borisov, Nastya Vertinskaya - all signed; As a result, the theater was divided, after which, it seems to me, it went somewhere into the abyss. I love Efremov very much, but he is getting old, his strength is becoming less and less... I am incredibly painful and sorry to see how the Art Theater is falling apart. Some actors have gone to the “other world”, others to other theaters, and I don’t want to work with people who look at me like some kind of fossil - and there’s no need... And then four years ago my students from school -the Moscow Art Theater studios encouraged me to create my own theater. We have already produced four performances, three of which I consider successful. So it turns out that, on the one hand, I still remained a member of the Moscow Art Theater, but on the other...

- ...the Moscow Art Theater itself no longer exists.

In fact of the matter. I’m finishing one role at Khudozhestvenny - and that’s all, actually. I would like to finally play in my theater: a year ago Lenkom released “Czech Photo”, and before that I had not played anything new for five years. The last role was in “The Players”, a production of Jursky, where he gathered all the “stars”.

- Why haven’t you played for so long?

So he wrote letters, got money, “broke a place”... Sponsors are lying, the authorities are in crisis - they have no time for us: eternal elections... They promise all the time: “Let’s wait out the elections!” Before you know it, it’s time to choose the next ones. It’s like being in a madhouse... Businessmen are afraid to invest money in art: now the legislation is so shaky... Cinema in general has completely collapsed - those are still the times... It’s difficult, of course, but, I’ll tell you, it’s insanely interesting. You are amazed, but theaters somehow exist, they fight, they swarm... And the opportunity to realize themselves has arisen. For example, I never thought that I would become an artistic director of a theater. True, I recently overdid it: when I learned that we had once again been scammed with money, I yelled too loudly on the phone... Probably, the accumulation of negative emotions exceeded all norms, went off scale - and I had a heart attack. Out of the blue - I never expected it in my life... It happened on the ninth of August, and on the tenth I was supposed to fly to England to rest - complete nonsense...

- Isn’t the price for theater space too high?

But we got our own home. Construction is in full swing, and I think we will open the stage in March. Previously, we were “homeless”: sometimes the theater was playing there, sometimes here. And, imagine, our colleagues charged us three times for renting the hall. I swore that if we got the premises, I would never charge my colleagues a single kopeks. Anything can happen: either the roof in the theater will leak, or the wall will collapse... And then they will come to me: “Sasha, let me play...” - in this case, they will only pay for utilities, and I will never take rent. Naturally, I’m talking now about “my” drama theatres. It’s another matter if they ask to provide a hall for commercial performances - foreign tours, various shows...

- And presentations?

Yes, at least they are. Of course, I will not allow debauchery on my stage. But something solid - please, pay and hold events... The main thing is that we have put an end to "bomzhatnichestvo"... No, our life today is extremely interesting. Everything changes right before our eyes... True, most often - not at all for the better. You know what's amazing? The communists, even if they tied you hand and foot with benefits that they themselves gave, but, in any case, at least responded to dissatisfaction. Peculiar: they could persuade, sweeten, buy, imprison...

-...shoot...

Or - put you in prison for so long that you will die quietly and calmly... But - they reacted! And now no one reacts to anything at all - that’s what’s incredible. The worst thing is indifference, as Arkady Isaakovich Raikin said. They react - it means you are not indifferent. It means you are loved.

- Speaking of love. How did your family react to you becoming chairman of the Union of Theater Workers?

They weren’t very welcoming - what can I say for a long time... My wife and daughter were scared, my sixteen-year-old son also warned in a matter-of-fact manner: “Look, dad, it’s going to be hard for you.” In general, the reaction is quite predictable. Everything is correct, this is how relatives should react.

- I remember one of your long-ago interviews in a Soviet - then still - newspaper. To the question: “How is Kalyagin Jr. doing?” - you answered: “The younger Kalyagin Alexander Alexandrovich is currently yelling: he demands that his diapers be changed... -

It's crazy... God, when did this happen?

It's a sin to complain. My daughter is in America - she has already become a real American. Whether or not she receives dual citizenship is her business. She works on computers, programming - pah-pah-pah, everything is fine with her. My son is there, studying at a very prestigious private school, George School, near Philadelphia.

- Is training expensive?

Naturally, my wife and I decided to go for it. The fact is that our guy was too domestic. I felt that with my energy and will I was cutting it down at the root; he lived with everything ready, without any worries. It was urgent to tear him away from us. And, you know, I think we did the right thing: we receive continuous certificates of merit and certificates. Sashka is interested in languages, takes extra lessons in Spanish - he could die from it. He, unlike his daughter, is a pronounced humanitarian and artistic person. Maybe he will become a writer.

- Aren’t you and your wife upset that your children did not follow in your footsteps?

I beg you!.. It’s very good that you didn’t go. There is no need to rape anyone.

- Indeed, one can recall many examples when children of actors, having already entered theaters, did not stay there and did something completely different...

Well, of course! And ours were not “sick” of the acting profession. Ksanyulka, my daughter, having completed the French ten-year school, casually asked: “Dad, what if I go to theater school?” Hearing this: “what if...”, I replied: “Over my corpse! You need to rave about the theater.” And then, she’s petite - no acting “exterior” for you. No need!

- Do parents, Alexander Kalyagin and Evgenia Glushenko, have such a powerful acting “exterior”?

Well, maybe I expressed myself poorly... The main thing is that children have a tendency towards completely different things.

- What is Evgenia Glushenko doing today?

My People's Artist plays at the Maly Theater... Not everything is brilliant there either: after receiving the Russian Army Theater, director Boris Morozov left there. There is practically no direction left, and Zhenyura has always worked with strong directors - Kheifetz, Morozov... So she has enough of her own problems.

- Sasha, I just witnessed someone asking you for an autograph in the elevator. Probably they don’t allow passage in Israel?

They recognize, smile, stop - normal. It’s good here... I’ve now come here for the fourth time, but I’ll remember my first impression of Israel forever. July, the heat is terrible, the air conditioner is humming all the time, seedless watermelons and the stunning Mediterranean Sea... I couldn’t swim even two meters - my head popped up and joyfully announced: “We know you!” As you swim further, the next head appears from under your arm: “Are you coming to us forever?” Almost at sea, such a small creative evening took place... Trying in vain to swim, I answered to the right that I had not come forever, but only on tour; to the left I explained how much I like everything here... Judge for yourself: could I disappoint your Jews by admitting that I don’t like the local heat?

- But, but: the Israeli heat is the best in the world!

Everything is correct, but then I didn’t know about it yet... It’s very nice, of course, to experience this love... I can’t complain that I was previously deprived of audience attention in Israel, but the current reception simply shocked me. This is understandable: a million of my viewers live here - where can you get away from them? And I don’t want to go anywhere...

At this point we were interrupted literally mid-sentence: it was time for Alexander Alexandrovich to go to the performance. And I still owe a debt: the end of the incident at the airport... The next day after the events described, I accidentally ended up in a house, where I came face to face with Kalyagin. We were introduced, and I asked: “San Sanych, have the flowers withered?” - "Which flowers?" - “Well, the same ones that you bought at the airport yesterday. A guy with glasses also helped you - remember?” Kalyagin was completely stunned: “How did you know about this?” I shrugged: “That’s the profession... And then, didn’t they tell you that the Mosad daily transmits the most important information to all newspapers?..” Having admired the effect produced, I left... Today I reminded Kalyagin of that old story, he clapped hit himself on the forehead: “But I’m thinking: where have I seen you before?” This time I had to admit that Kalyagin’s “flower” guide turned out to be my own husband. Alexander Alexandrovich laughed a lot...

September 9, 2001
Live on the radio station “Echo of Moscow” Alexander Kalyagin, chief director of the “Et Cetera” theater.
The broadcast is hosted by Ksenia Larina.

K. LARINA 11.10 in Moscow. This is our theatrical hour and we will meet with Alexander Kalyagin, the main director of the Et Cetera theater and talk with him over the next 40 minutes. Yes, yes, yes, you want more. (Laughter). Oh, San Sanych rolled his eyes, he was surprised at how much time, well, time flies by quickly. I am glad to welcome Alexander Kalyagin, our neighbor in the staircase, to our studio. Hello, San Sanych, we go to each other in slippers and dressing gowns, sometimes for salt, sometimes for matches.
A. KALYAGIN They'll think God knows what!
K. LARINA (Laughs). On the ground floor, work is in full swing, as usual, for some reason Alexander Kalyagin just can’t calm down, he’s always remodeling the main entrance, I can’t understand what doesn’t suit him. Here and there, why are you doing this, tell me?
A. KALYAGIN Good question, it is very relevant, if the Moscow authorities hear it, it is more relevant. The fact is that, Ksenichka, we have reconstruction and construction ahead.
K. LARINA Here?
A. KALYAGIN Yes, construction of a theater building. And while we are forced, as they say, to be neighbors, we want to somehow more or less arrange our entrance and exit, that’s all, nothing more. Because all the merchants who are on Novy Arbat, on the former Kalinin Avenue, are coming. Everyone is annoying, they go under our canopy, build their huts, trade, and so on. Well, I already told them that Christ expelled them from the temple, so I wanted to be simpler, so I treat them quite coolly, they, some of my friends have already become, some are in conflict. Well, in short, we really need to arrange it so that the audience who comes to our theater sees at least an aesthetically pleasing
K. LARINA Theater, front door.
A. KALYAGIN Theater entrance. The proximity doesn’t bother me; I’ve seen these in the West, when there are several institutions in one room, including a theater. Moreover, our theater space is very large, 400 seats after all.
K. LARINA Nice room, very cozy, I like visiting you there. Will you rebuild the same premises or will you build a separate building?
A. KALYAGIN No, the same room, there will be a small stage on top, and a separate entrance from Arbatsky Lane.
K. LARINA I see.
A. KALYAGIN From this isthmus.
K. LARINA Well, let's talk about creativity now.
A. KALYAGIN Yes, let's do it.
K. LARINA What are you rehearsing and when are you going to show it?
A. KALYAGIN We opened very quietly, modestly, in a workmanlike way.
K. LARINA Without attracting attention.
A. KALYAGIN Without attracting attention, because, well, in general we are supposed to invite the press and city authorities or the cultural committee there. Everyone knows that we have opened, but the main thing is to start working, especially since we have two premieres that should be released I literally hope by November. Two premieres, “The King of Ubu”, by the French author Alfred Zhary, will be staged here for the first time. It is staged by a very talented person, Alexander Morfov, who long ago made a name for himself both in Moscow and St. Petersburg
K. LARINA He’s already staged it for you, right?
A. KALYAGIN Yes, he staged Don Quixote with us. And Dmitry Bertman, the next premiere will be “My Fair Lady”.
K. LARINA Who are your artists?
A. KALYAGIN Our artists are with the orchestra, they all sing with the orchestra of the Ministry of Defense, jazz. Well and so on, this is an expensive, I would say, expensive production, from what we will see, I hope.
K. LARINA Are you, as an actor, in what performance?
A. KALYAGIN “King Ubu”.
K. LARINA What kind of thing? Tell us a little about her, if possible.
A. KALYAGIN You know, can I not tell you, Ksenia? I never, during filming
K. LARINA Well, I’m not asking about the performance, but about the play.
A. KALYAGIN Can I not talk too? Because I explain why. This play is quite complex, it is the beginning of French symbolism. This is a play that, at one time, was staged in Paris and was spat on, scolded, and so on and so forth. Now it has become a classic, well, it always does. Now it has become a classic and this is a harbinger, perhaps, of the Brechtian direction in theatrical art.
A. KALYAGIN Alexander Sanych, are you happy with yourself in the theater, like the actor Kalyagin?
A. KALYAGIN You know, I have no time to think. I’ll tell you honestly, I don’t have time to think about these questions, because work I have to be a director, work is work, and also the chairman of the union.
K. LARINA Secretary General, I usually say this, this is how I introduce you.
A. KALYAGIN Still stop and think, even at night such thoughts are good
K. LARINA That is, the time of doubt is behind us, right?
A. KALYAGIN No, there are always doubts, but am I satisfied with myself or that, you know, I need to work. I don’t know what I want to prove, I don’t need to prove anything, but I still want to do something, again, notice, I say: I want to do something. I don’t want any specific promises, specific authors or productions. I still want to do something while I have the strength, while I have the opportunity, while my memory holds the text, well, and so on. Well, nothing more. I am quite modest about these arguments. I don't care about the main thing I do on stage.
K. LARINA Well, you, of course, are in an enviable position, since you have the opportunity and right to choose a job for yourself, what is interesting to you and what is not very interesting, unlike most of your fellow workers.
A. KALYAGIN You know, well, we had such a situation at the Moscow Art Theater, when I became a leading actor, Efremov also offered me to choose. And Anatoly Vasilyevich Efros also talked to me about whether I should or shouldn’t, whether I agree or disagree, but, of course, at that time I was still, how to say, “under direction,” so, of course, I listened more. Now, oddly enough, there are a lot of offers, a lot of offers to just play, and to bet on me, and enterprises, here and there. But, in my opinion, I have passed the age when, in my youth, I played everything that was written.
K. LARINA But Shylock, did you want to play him, or was it Sturua’s suggestion?
A. KALYAGIN No, it was Robert Sturua’s proposal. In general, that’s why I’m spoiled, so to speak, by gifts from directors, I’ve already said that. Therefore, I already have to think about something specific: I want to play
K. LARINA But Mikhail Mikhalych Kozakov just dreamed, it was his dream to play Shylock.
A. KALYAGIN Okay, but this is my fate, and this is the line of my fate, it has already been proven. What I think about comes either much later than the idea itself, and not the next day or year, or does not come at all. Therefore, everything that I did in theater and cinema was all connected with the fact that I didn’t think, I threw myself into the pool, went to offers with an open eye, with an open soul and that’s it, nothing more.
K. LARINA You know, yesterday I watched “Slave of Love” on NTV+. And once again, watching these Mikhalkov films with your participation, “The Unfinished Play”, of course, comes to mind, first of all, it always seems to me that before everything was subtler, smarter, more interesting, if we talk about cinema, in this case . Why? It would seem that the mid-70s, the most disgusting time, the most sour, stagnant time. How were such things born? This level of conversation with the viewer?
A. KALYAGIN Much depends, of course, on the individuals who suddenly united, or something illuminated them, of course. This is on the one hand, on the other hand, of course, despite that time, we still all latently understood that we could not drown without, of course, holding on to material wealth. Because everyone lived almost the same way, you know. An actor who earns 2 rubles more, or 2 rubles less, practically no longer plays a role. Now the difference in everything: in the psychological structure of the acting workshop, directing, playwrights, is very striking. In general, now, recently, especially after watching some performances, over the past 2 years I have had this, perhaps not very pleasant thought for me: we have begun to become bourgeois in theater and film art. I emphasize, bourgeoisification in a bad sense. This does not mean the price of the ticket, or the price of the production. I spent, maybe, a million dollars, or the ticket costs, maybe, 100 dollars. No, that’s not the point, you can spend 100 dollars, you can spend a lot of money. But we teach the viewer, and criticism also contributes to this, and we ourselves, the viewer, we teach the viewer to quickly perceive art. You say, now it’s unthinkable to release a film like “Slave of Love,” because the viewer already exists at such a pace, and is so accustomed to flashing, to everything, to everything, just flashing, that there is time to digest, time to pause, I’m not saying it’s for a minute, but at least a 20-second, 10-second pause when a person thinks, he doesn’t have. Even on vacation, he always wants it, it’s such an addiction, you know, all the time it’s not enough, all the time. We followed the “good” Western path, and lost a lot in this process, and we came to what I’m saying. Now to consider the process of the performance is something only a theater lover can do.
K. LARINA Professional viewer.
A. KALYAGIN Or a critic who will consider, say, Nyakrosius for a long time, will follow his thought for a long time, and what he wanted to say behind it. But, in principle, it’s one or two people in the theater, one or two. And I don’t even see people like that in our movies.
K. LARINA Sokurov.
A. KALYAGIN Well, look at how his films are performing at the box office here. This is only for a small hall, we are sitting in a small room, here you can gather 10-20 people. In principle, this is impossible, and we, unfortunately, contributed to this. And such art, not because I want to say, tomorrow we will stage it slowly, tediously
K. LARINA Slow and sad.
A. KALYAGIN No, it’s just, unfortunately, I fell into this rhythm, and, unfortunately, I’m in this wheel. But I realize that this is bad and I will try my best to somehow resist it. Although... there, suppose, I hope, there will be a wonderful production by Dmitry Bertman, we have long wanted to stage “My Fair Lady,” but this does not mean that this is the general path of the theater, a musical, for me, in particular, a musical or some kind of show, although I understand that the theater must master everything. I'm talking about the human consciousness, the spectator's consciousness, the viewer is already languishing, if, with a good acting, with talented direction, they try to, or force him, or hint at him so that he thinks, he already begins to languish, he cannot stand it, he wants to get up, something itches him and he leaves.
K. LARINA What should those who still want to think do? Give up the theater altogether?
A. KALYAGIN Sit and watch and absorb, and not pay attention to the tramp of feet leaving the hall, in the cinema or in the theater room.
K. LARINA So, do you think that time is the main culprit of this bourgeoisification?
A. KALYAGIN No, it seems to me, we ourselves, ourselves. To waste time is a useless matter. We ourselves, our endless decade, when we were chasing some kind of chimeras and ethers, imitation, and so on, and so on. We ourselves, of course, ourselves. I am largely convinced that what we do, we do with our own hands. Because there is always the right to choose, there are always several roads, even according to a Russian folk tale, three paths, you go right, you go left, you go straight. But for some reason we choose to quickly enter a community that, as it were, can help us. In fact, we are losing, I’m not talking about the specific Russian way, no, God forbid, I’m not preaching this, I’m talking about the loss of human consciousness, after all, our culture is the highest, and nothing can be done. What I saw, for example, the premiere of Zholdak’s “The Seagull,” once again suggests that this is possible.
K. LARINA And this is also possible.
A. KALYAGIN And this is also possible. In principle, this is impossible, it should not be. Not because it should be banned, but because the people who watch, because the people who agree to it, he is a talented person, but I don’t care, because it is meaningless from beginning to end. But this probably means that people who go for it, in this case, our brother, an actor, who goes for it, he believes that it is possible, and here is the danger for me. And the spectators who come to see this, they also think that this is possible.
K. LARINA Let me remind you that our guest today is Alexander Kalyagin, actor, director of the Et Cetera theater, general secretary of the Union of Theater Workers.
A. KALYAGIN Come on, I have a lot of enemies, by the way, listen, they can even kill you.
K. LARINA Well, what are you talking about!
A. KALYAGIN Chairman of the Union.
K. LARINA Modest chairman. You said about Zholdak’s “The Seagull” that it doesn’t give the impression of what you need. Well, tell me, let’s remember the theatrical Olympics, a wonderful theatrical festival, but what struck me there, I’ve already talked about it. It seemed to me that there is such a tendency, in principle, in the European theater, to refuse the services of the artist as a person, that is, to fill the whole thing with all sorts of sounds, pyrotechnics, makeup, costumes, brightness, some metaphors, and the actor
A. KALYAGIN Well, in the cinema it was almost done, thanks to these computer-generated ones, well, really, people just stuck on De Niro’s face, and that’s it, and you can make a film, and the fees for this one, drawn, edited, I don’t know, will not be so crazy, how to say, De Niro. But that’s not the point, the point is that, Ksenia, on the one hand, you are right, on the other hand, of course, that is, there is such a tendency, of course. But I still have a strange feeling that humanity is still returning to its needs, basic needs. All the same, you will eat what you need with a fork, what you need with a spoon, and this is already programmed by nature. You would still want to hear normal human speech, you would still want the actor to breathe and speak alive, and you would want to see his living eyes, of course. Therefore, it seems to me that these fluctuations are normal, but I don’t see such a dangerous trend, I see the danger only in the fact that I, for example, as Zholdak, a talented person, I named only because when I read a review of performance by Zholdak Bartoshevich, I even applauded, because it really is so. In fact, this is disgusting even towards Chekhov. Getting enough sleep is like being taken to the museum where Peter I had his office, his bed. And the person breaks this chain, goes to this bed and lies down in his boots, and generally does everything there that Wait a minute, this is historical, we saved it for many years so that posterity could see. But apparently this is possible. I’m saying that banning or not banning is not the topic of conversation, I’m saying that this arises only because there are prerequisites for this, prerequisites for such bourgeoisification, quickly, such chewing gum, quickly, quickly “Dirol” in your mouth, quickly, some kind of amber has formed in your mouth, you suck out the sweet, suck out the menthol and spit it out, and quickly put another piece of gum into your mouth. It’s stupid to chew it all day, it’s boring. I think that we are all to blame, we all had a hand in this, but, in the end, theater is theater, it’s still living art, you still want to see pictures that aren’t drawn
K. LARINA A real person
A. KALYAGIN - here, an American director, but real ones.
K. LARINA In this case, how to survive in such conditions? I do not quite understand. You yourself say that we are to blame for this, you yourself are following this path, bourgeoisification, as you put it. Should someone counter this somehow?
A. KALYAGIN No, but I'm trying. I! It's funny to say!
K. LARINA Not alone, yes.
A. KALYAGIN I don’t go to the barricade and say that I’m trying, but I’m trying to at least realize that this is a dangerous path. I am still internally resisting this. These are observations, well, the Olympics have passed, there is a festival there, the Golden Mask, I come to other festivals in different cities, I watch the performances of my colleagues in Moscow. And I see that, in principle, this trend exists. The strange thing is that I was now in New York, watching The Seagull.
K. LARINA Again.
A. KALYAGIN Yes, “The Seagull”, and Meryl Streep plays Arkadina, and German Klanin plays Trigorin and Natalie Portman plays Nina Zarechnaya. Something was successful, something was unsuccessful, but I had a complete impression, the performance runs for 3 hours, I there was a complete impression that the director had studied Russian productions of Chekhov's plays very well. And there are such pauses, and there is such a leisurely game, and Trigorin’s leisurely monologue about his fate. And Arkadina, Meryl Streep, she plays fantastically, it seemed to me that I ended up at the Moscow Art Theater, that he studied “The Seagull” well, which was directed by Efremov, looked well at “The Mechanical Piano” by Nikita Mikhalkov, in general he studied Chekhov’s material well. Full auditorium, free, 1.5 months. The stars set a condition: play for free. I understand, one might say cynically, that their fees are such that they can
K. LARINA Why free?
A. KALYAGIN And free of charge. For a month and a half we played in Central Park, in Manhattan, playing this “The Seagull”. People were standing in line, I took pictures of this line with my camera, people were standing in line, it was a kilometer-long line, with beds. They arrived at 10 pm, the police kicked them out of Central Park, and until 6 am they were forced to stand near Central Park, on the sidewalks. Then they entered Central Park again, with all their luggage, with their mattresses, with their food, and the next evening they stood there for a day and a half, and the evening the next day, they may or may not get in. Moreover, the tickets at the ticket office were torn from the ticket book like this: you are standing in line with me, you will not necessarily sit next to me. You may come across the 20th row, I will find the first row. This is not like at the window, please give me the first one. There is a queue, free entry, and therefore you can get any tickets. But it's gorgeous, gorgeous. There are a lot of people, I’m pleased that they are leisurely watching Chekhov.
K. LARINA Even they are capable of this? Even Americans?
A. KALYAGIN Even them. Because there is, of course, a Broadway version of art, and it is also good, and also has its own audience. And there is this, how many young people, how many old people stand for days to get to this performance, decorously, measuredly. I’m not saying that “oh, how everything worked out!” there, in the production itself.
K. LARINA But they play for real?
A. KALYAGIN Yes, Meryl Streep plays great. Really everything: scenery, tables, wardrobe, plates, food, a wicker chair that creaks, Goldman plays Shamraev Good!
K. LARINA Okay, let's go back to Russia.
A. KALYAGIN Come on.
K. LARINA What, censorship is not needed? Some artistic councils, as it was before, still somehow assess the level, in this case, of the theater. What is possible, what is not.
A. KALYAGIN No. Censorship can be understood in this way for us, the word censorship gives us goosebumps. No, censorship is not needed, but there should be some kind of legislation regarding how long we can, well, roughly speaking, undress an actor, or the desecration of some of our values, there should be legislation, but, you know, this is a normal phenomenon. America has been following this path for a long time, and has long given up on everyone. It's the same in France. There is porn art, there is great art - please don’t mix it with the other. If you want to go there, they have their own legislation; if you want to go to the theater, they have their own legal norms.
K. LARINA Everything is just mixed up here.
A. KALYAGIN We have everything mixed up.
K. LARINA Unfortunately, because, returning to the pathetic words about the role of art in human life, I still think that it educates, cultivates taste.
A. KALYAGIN Of course.
K. LARINA Yes? After all, who shapes it for us, it’s true, what we see, the world around us, is television, is radio, is a book, is it theater or cinema. So it turns out that
A. KALYAGIN Correct.
K. LARINA Should I let you go, Alexander Sanych? I'm letting go.
A. KALYAGIN It's time.
K. LARINA I am releasing Alexander Kalyagin. Now, I’ll see what good things our listeners, your viewers, wrote. Quickly answer a couple of questions. They ask about new actors in your theater, has anyone come this season, new, young?
A. KALYAGIN Yes, they came, from Shchepkinsky, from the studio school, they came, good actors. Anyway, our troupe is small, 23 people.
K. LARINA “Alexander, don’t despair, people who reflect and think have already stopped attending the shows and performances that you told us about,” Kirill writes to us. Just like that.
A. KALYAGIN No, I don’t despair, I have to attend the show, but to each his own.
K. LARINA Ruzanna Borodina writes to you: “Dear beloved actor, I am so glad to hear your voice, I beg you, stop doing administrative work! I saw you for the first time when you read “Notes of a Madman” at the Ermolova Theater. Please, play more!”
A. KALYAGIN Well, come, if you’ve seen it so long ago, well, come and see what I’ve been doing in the last years of my life (laughs).
K. LARINA Well, okay, stop it. Now, one last question: “How do you hire a director for productions, how do directors get to you?” - listeners ask.
A. KALYAGIN This is very difficult, Ksenia, you yourself know what a difficult, tedious process it is to select a director who would suit your taste, the theater, and so on.
K. LARINA Well, that’s it, I’m letting go, I already feel it, there’s no time.
A. KALYAGIN Thank you very much!
K. LARINA Thank you.
A. KALYAGIN Thank you to the audience, thank you to the listeners.
K. LARINA Thank you, this is Alexander Kalyagin, good luck to you!